You have just entered room "engcitguy Chat02."

girl5024 has entered the room.

EricLBecker1982 has entered the room.

engcitguy: hey now

girl5024: I'M EARLY!!!

engcitguy: hold on while i finish prepping.

EricLBecker1982: I had a bunch of ENG 103 students IMing me last night asking me about their 
papers and tests.  ::Laughs::

engcitguy: heheh

engcitguy: howd you get on their list?

EricLBecker1982: It seems that a question I asked about the test got sent out to that group.

EricLBecker1982: I don't know, I didn't get the e-mail that they were talking about.

girl5024 has left the room.

engcitguy: interesting..not sure how that happened

engcitguy: br

engcitguy: brb

EricLBecker1982: They told me they got some e-mail from you about test stuff and that an e-mail 
from me was attached, so they IMed me on my regular AOL name and started asking me about 
English 103 stuff.  Needless to say, I was lost.

girl5024 has entered the room.

girl5024: sorry got disconnected

engcitguy: sorry about that

EricLBecker1982: Girl, apparently the room can't handle your energy tonight!

EricLBecker1982: Oh, it's all right, the English 103 people were very talkative, much moreso than 
the English 101 people.  ::Laughs::

girl5024: sorry... have my son clinging to my side

engcitguy: any questions about the test?

engcitguy: it's likely many will want to discuss it in specific tonight

engcitguy: but so far you are the only ones here

girl5024: the first is on thursday, right?

engcitguy: yes

girl5024: k

EricLBecker1982: I set my appointment for Thursday evening at 7 P.M. after I get off of work.



engcitguy: ok

girl5024: having trouble typing tonight?? hehehe

EricLBecker1982: The test covers Character and "Bride", right?

engcitguy: yes

EricLBecker1982: It's his speech-to-type program.

FRECKLS4ME has entered the room.

girl5024: it doesn't work to well if you ask me

engcitguy: i am eating

girl5024: talking with your mouth full? haha

EricLBecker1982: Ah, so extra letter j's and "ruggru bugru bug"s will get in there?

engcitguy: indeed

engcitguy: yes

engcitguy: anyway

engcitguy: any other general questions about the test

EricLBecker1982: I'm assuming that it's all essay answer?

engcitguy: absolutely

engcitguy: just like a paper

engcitguy: only shorter

engcitguy: intro should have author

engcitguy: title

EricLBecker1982: Complete sentences and all those fun things.

engcitguy: your point

engcitguy: in this case, that will be...

engcitguy: yes

engcitguy: and spelllllling counts

EricLBecker1982: Will it be one question or many questions?

engcitguy: hehehe

engcitguy: one

EricLBecker1982: All right.

engcitguy: you already know the question

EricLBecker1982: So I can't rite lyk this thein, huh?

engcitguy: do you folks want to discuss the test?

engcitguy: heheh

engcitguy: you can

engcitguy: but yer grade will suck

FRECKLS4ME: the question is about character, right?

Mandrini87 has entered the room.

engcitguy: yes freckles

FRECKLS4ME: thanks

EricLBecker1982: I'm going to make sure that I understand the question...you may remember my 
blunder with comprehending the concept of the due date.

engcitguy: if you folks want to discuss the test, I will monitor the conversation.

FRECKLS4ME: The test has to be completed by Feb 1, correct?

engcitguy: yes

engcitguy: I encourage you to discuss possible answers to the test, but I will neither confirm nor 
deny any answers are given.  I expect you to ask each other the same questions I would ask you.  
In other words show me were you got the answer that you did

FRECKLS4ME: can I ask a question unrelated to the test?

engcitguy: I will be here to clarify specific terms etc., but I will not comment on its applicability to 
this particular story

engcitguy: yes freckles

FRECKLS4ME: how long does it take to get a response from turnitin?

EricLBecker1982: Okay, just to clarify what it has to do with character....am I right in assuming 
that our test essay will be covering the aspects of the characters within the story "A Bride Comes 
To Yellow Sky"?

engcitguy: about 24 hours freckles

FRECKLS4ME: thanks

engcitguy: what aspects Eric

FRECKLS4ME: thats what i understand too.

EricLBecker1982: As in flat, round, static, developing, etc.

engcitguy: in other words, if I were to ask you about character, what specific things are you going 
to talk about

L8T Jayde has entered the room.

engcitguy: exactly

Mandrini87: Question (First Paper related):  If no one chooses to edit my first paper, should I turn 
it in directly to you engcitguy, and if not, how long should I wait before the deadline?  I'm 
expecting to have some corrective surgery done Friday and don't think I'll be in any shape to turn 
anything then, let alone type on a computer.

engcitguy: do you folks want to discuss the test?

girl5024: i'm not too good at writing essays, can someone stay on with me for a few min after the 
chat to give me some help on writing body paragraphs?

L8T Jayde: What have I missed?

EricLBecker1982: All right, I just wanted to make sure I was understanding that right.

engcitguy: man, all you can do is post your paper on turnit in.com.  If no one reviews it, you have 
done your part.

engcitguy: not much J.

engcitguy: we are discussing the test and papers in general

engcitguy: your understanding perfectly Eric

EricLBecker1982: Also, in regards to turnitin....we're supposed to read a paper and then submit 
our critique on the message boards, correct?

engcitguy: correct

engcitguy: mention it by title

EricLBecker1982: All right, can do.

engcitguy: be sure to analyze the intended goals of the paper, not whether you liked it or not

engcitguy: in other words, whether the author has used text, literary terms, etc.

girl5024: eric, who are you talking to?

EricLBecker1982: That makes sense.....it would be boring to get 50 posts saying "I really liked 
this paper a lot."

engcitguy: has used text

engcitguy: exactly

EricLBecker1982: I am talking to Professer Eiland, thank you.

FRECKLS4ME: what if your not sure about your own paper, how do you review someone else's

engcitguy: once again, are you folks ready to discuss the test story, bride comes to yellow sky

EricLBecker1982: Well, I suppose we could.

EricLBecker1982: It's either that or the Super Bowl commericals, and I've heard enough about 
those already.

girl5024: text meaning basic quotes from the book?

engcitguy: freckles, that is a good question.  The whole purpose behind peer editing is to do several things.

engcitguy: 1.  You get a general idea whether or not your paper in terms of style and content is in 
the same ballpark as everyone else

engcitguy: 2.  Perhaps the deficiencies in another paper will alert you to the deficiencies in your 
own

engcitguy: 3.  Perhaps some of the positive aspects of the other paper will remind you what to 
include in your own

engcitguy: yes girl

girl5024: thanks

engcitguy: you're welcome

FRECKLS4ME: i was afraid to read someone else's before i finished mine for fear i would put the 
to together

engcitguy: the same goes for discussing the test before hand.  For many of you, you don't know if 
you're on the right track.  But knowing what others think may help you to formulate yer own ideas.  
Just because someone says something, does not make it right.  But if their observations seem to 
coincide with yours, perhaps you're both on the right track, especially if you can SUPPORT 
YOUR ANSWER

FRECKLS4ME: are we graded on our review of someone else's paper

engcitguy: your participation grade suffers if you do not review another paper

L8T Jayde: really I didn't know this

Mandrini87: Engcitguy: I never picked up on where exactly (under which folder) on the message 
board we should post our reviews.  Please clarify.

engcitguy: then I'm glad you're here J.

EricLBecker1982: So an adequate review gets us full credit for that specific assignment.

FRECKLS4ME: okay, does it suffer if we review in incorrectly

EricLBecker1982: (Not the paper itself, but the review of the paper.)

engcitguy: man, it is under the folder called PEER EDIT

engcitguy: freckles, if you review incorrectly, I will explain to you what you're missing, and 
perhaps that will help you improve your own paper

FRECKLS4ME: okay thank you that's great.

engcitguy: in awards, if you focus on how well the author discuss the plot, then you yourself 
would not be showing that you know what I am looking for.  If the review is off the point, I remind 
you in a private message telling you where to re focus your attention



L8T Jayde: I have been there to read up on some the to see how mine is comparing to theirs but 
not to peer edit. I guess I will be doing this tonight also along with a million other things.

engcitguy: anything else about the pier edit function

FRECKLS4ME: i'm right there with you jayde

engcitguy: for those who actually attend class on Tuesdays, their peer editing is done then

L8T Jayde: attend class?

EricLBecker1982: He's got an Integrated class that meets on Tuesdays.

engcitguy: also be aware that one of the functions of that program is it tells me if someone is 
plagiarizing someone else's paper

engcitguy: yes

L8T Jayde: thanks

engcitguy: and anyone is welcome to attend

engcitguy: your welcome

engcitguy: anything else about the paper

EricLBecker1982: Out of curiosity, what time on Tuesdays does it meet?

girl5024: if we attend do we have to do that chat too?

engcitguy: 11  to 1220 in LB 310

engcitguy: no girl

engcitguy: not that you would want to miss all this excitement

EricLBecker1982: Ah...well, I've got basketball during that time, but if that class ever gets 
cancelled, I'll stop by.

engcitguy: feel free Eric

L8T Jayde: I'm at work fighting with kids at that time

engcitguy: well, if you get a chance between rounds, stop on by J.

girl5024: lucky you jayde

L8T Jayde: Oh I will

EricLBecker1982: (Intramural, of course.....if I had enough talent to make the varsity team, I 
wouldn't be working in child care.  ::Laughs::-)

L8T Jayde: Ha Ha 

engcitguy: any other questions about the paper

L8T Jayde: yes, am I still able to post mine and get that credit I have had lots of trouble with 
getting it started

engcitguy: post your what J

engcitguy: comments about chat?

L8T Jayde: paper

Mandrini87: engcitguy: regarding the test, I took it.  50 minutes was not sufficient time to do it 
although it seemed to pose a simple question(s).  If one takes longer than that, are they penalized?

EricLBecker1982: turnitin.com was having some problems with returning information to the client 
side (that's my computer for those who aren't familiar with web jargon) a couple of times when I 
tried accessing it.

engcitguy: it would have to be tonight, because with the 24-hour turnaround time, it is unlikely you 
get any comments before the first

L8T Jayde: ok I can do that will this hurt my grade?

engcitguy: if turnitin is not working, Eric, then that's not your fault.  However, I have been 
checking turnitin on a regular basis and it always seems to work for me

engcitguy: No J.

engcitguy: man, your comment is not new.  The reality is that everyone who takes English 101 at 
citrus college has to take an exit exam that takes 50 minutes.  There is no extra time allowed.  
That is why all written exams in English 101 are only allowed 50 minutes

timallen8 has entered the room.

timallen8: Hello

engcitguy: more to the point, the questions that you're asked for a cast are designed for a short 
answer

timallen8: Bonnie hello

Mandrini87: You're drive a hard deal, Mr. E.  

engcitguy: as for the test

engcitguy: hey now tim and Bonnie

timallen8: YO

L8T Jayde: good first paper seems to have freaked me out having to study for this paper and the 
test on two different stories have lost me but with some help from my friends I think I will be able 
to catch up 

FRECKLS4ME: test on two stories???

girl5024: bride and character

girl5024: right??

EricLBecker1982: Freckls:  Jayde meant to say the paper's on one story and the test is on a 
different story.

L8T Jayde: no my paper and the test sorry

engcitguy: the point is that a class like this is designed to get you to do a great deal of reading 
and writing.  That is because as you take harder in her class is the amount of reading and writing 
will increase.  You have had a couple weeks to work on your paper.  

engcitguy: And the test only needs to be five paragraphs.  You know what the topic is.  It should 
be a fairly short concise answer, using the story to back up your answer

FRECKLS4ME: okay 

engcitguy: That is because as you take harder and harder classes..

Mandrini87: I was only given one testpaper on "Bride".  I wasn't aware the only 5 paragraph limit 
on the test.

engcitguy: man, I'm telling you the minimum requirements

engcitguy: if you can write seven paragraphs in that time, knock yourself out

EricLBecker1982: 5 paragraphs....5 BODY paragraphs, or 5 total paragraphs?

engcitguy: what is expected is a fairly short concise answer that can be answered in 50 minutes 
and in five paragraphs

engcitguy: five total

engcitguy: intro

engcitguy: conclusion

engcitguy: three in the middle

EricLBecker1982: All right...with the opening thesis thing and the conclusion, okay, that makes 
sense.

girl5024: basically a short essay?

engcitguy: yes girl

engcitguy: and papers are long essays

engcitguy: designed for detail and many examples

engcitguy: are you folks ready to discuss the test

girl5024: sure

Mandrini87: Well, I guess so, in my case (hindsight is 20/20 as they say).

engcitguy: discuss character in bride comes yellow sky

engcitguy: who wants to start

engcitguy: the silence is deafening

FRECKLS4ME: i have another question  when you use a small quote such as "another color" 
from Once upon a time, do you still need to reference the author and page number

engcitguy: yes...any use of any of the authors words, even one specific word in any particular 
context, should be quoted and then cited correctly

FRECKLS4ME: thank you

engcitguy: you're welcome

EricLBecker1982: All the characters in the bar are flat.  They just sit there drinking and worry 
about Scratchy Wilson and his gun and talk about what would happen if Potter was in town and 
that's about all that those characters do.

engcitguy: a reminder folks: whether the characters are round or flat you must explain why, using 
the specific terms as explained on the Web site and in the book

timallen8: Inner conflict? Change?

engcitguy: exactly tim...

EricLBecker1982: No inner conflict, no change, all they do is sit around drinking and then their drinking gets interrupted.  They're static.

engcitguy: stereotype and stock as well

Mandrini87: I agree the characters were flat, however Wilson seemed to have enough complexity 
to make him an endearing character, the book mentioned he was "tender" in his gazes at his wife, 
he "gleefully" (as if boyishly) showed off his watch, he courageously faced Scratchy without a 
gun, but at the same time, he was your basic stereotypical good guy.

Mandrini87: Sorry not wilson, Potter.

engcitguy: keep the names straight too

engcitguy: heheh

Mandrini87: You got it, I'm getting senile in my 30's

EricLBecker1982: Potter was stock.  The good-guy-gun-slinger-hero type.  There was a personal 
touch, though: he didn't draw a gun (he didn't even have one in the story) and he had his wife 
next to him.

Mandrini87: Scratchy and Potter seemed to be overgrown kids coming to the realization that it 
was time to grow up.  Scratchy realized that a little later on after he realized the implications of his 
"nemesis" getting married.  Almost as if he was disappointed that his playpal moved on in life.

timallen8: BOnnie -refresh my memory on what a stock character means

EricLBecker1982: Stock character...a stereo-typed character that appears in many different 
stories.

engcitguy: stock is a reg char that shows up constantly...becomes so blatant it is easy to id

engcitguy: hero

engcitguy: bad guy

engcitguy: evil genius

engcitguy: damsel in distress

EricLBecker1982: Sleuth

timallen8: Bonnie- ok I understand

timallen8: BOnnie - thanks

engcitguy: knight in shining etc

engcitguy: any other comments?

engcitguy: is that it?

EricLBecker1982: Sorry...went to the bathroom.

engcitguy: thanks fer sharing

EricLBecker1982: Scratchy Wilson: Also a stock character.

girl5024: sorry too, working on my essay at the same time

timallen8: BOnnie is searching for her spectacles

engcitguy: when yer done talking test we can talk about theme

EricLBecker1982: Bad-guy stock character at that.

engcitguy: ok

Mandrini87: Sorry everyone, gotta split, this isn't my computer and the owner will have a coronary 
if I don't get off.  I'll reference this chat in the archives tomorrow.  Ciao'

timallen8: Are we on theme now?

Mandrini87 has left the room.

timallen8: Does this chat usually start at 7?

engcitguy: yes tim

engcitguy: i will start in theme when the testers say DONE

timallen8: Are we starting a new story?

EricLBecker1982: Does anybody else here see Scratchy Wilson as a rounded character?

timallen8: I do but I shan't say anything

engcitguy: hehehe

timallen8: Or maybe I don't

engcitguy: heheheh

EricLBecker1982: I think he's rounded and developing in that he basically grows up.  The time 
span is reasonable...perhaps he's sobered up a bit from his drinking?

timallen8: He is old.

EricLBecker1982: That part of the story occurs in such a short amount of time, I believe it's 
reasonable to say that Scratchy's character goes through a change.

timallen8: BOnnie - how does growing up make him round? Eric

FRECKLS4ME: what makes you say hes old.  Did i miss that somewhere in the story

engcitguy: folks, the general rule for the difference between a static character in a changing 
character is fundamental change.  You must show fundamental change of if you think the 
character has evolved

EricLBecker1982: A good point.

timallen8: he was from an earlier generation. A child of the plains.

engcitguy: folks, remember that an author includes detail in story because it is important to the 
story.  How well you remember the details may often be a determiner whether or not you 
understand the authors point

FRECKLS4ME: what change are you talking about eric

EricLBecker1982: Well, at first introduction, Scratchy Wilson seems intent to get into a gun fight, 
particularly with Potter, then when he finds out that Potter has gotten married, his view on it 
changes....the problem with short stories is that within their shortness, you don't know the events 
that occurred BEFORE the setting that the author has set up for the reader.

timallen8: The author does provide info on what happened before the story through the men at 
the bar

EricLBecker1982: Provides information, but only a look at past events, not at the full reasons 
behind them.

engcitguy: general point that I may have mentioned before, and certainly could mention again, is 
that all the information you need is included in story.  The author only includes information if it is 
necessary.  and the author does not include information that does not matter

EricLBecker1982: So we make our analysis based solely on the contents of what's in the story 
then.

engcitguy: yes

engcitguy: oftentimes, a big big mistake made by students is inserting their opinion, their 
experiences, or their own tendencies into a work when the author has clearly stated how 
acharacter feels

timallen8: did you discuss theme in class today before Bonnie and myself arrived

engcitguy: no Allen

engcitguy: but I do need to get started on it so that we can get onto the More difficult and more 
useful thematic elements

FRECKLS4ME: MORE difficult, thanks!

girl5024: no kidding!

engcitguy: after this test and after this paper, I will never ask you again whether or not a character 
is round or flat or a story is interpretive or escapist

engcitguy: no kidding

engcitguy: anytime freckles

engcitguy: 8~)

FRECKLS4ME: THANK YOU AGAIN!!

EricLBecker1982: All right, we can move onto theme if nobody else wants to discuss the test.

engcitguy: once we get into theme, we will also get into symbolism and irony, which are much 
more powerful tools

engcitguy: any objections to Erics suggestion?

FRECKLS4ME: no

timallen8: NAYE

engcitguy: lets talk about theme

engcitguy: theme is a fundamental aspect of all literature, especially the type of literature we use 
in this class

engcitguy: theme is the overriding idea or concept presented in the work

engcitguy: it will be evident in the plot, the character presentation, the overall ideas presented in 
the story, the conflicts, as well as represented in the symbols and irony that the author uses to 
promote the story

engcitguy: it permeates everything

engcitguy:  it is important to note that theme is not a moral to a story

engcitguy: theme is not what the author is telling us to do 

EricLBecker1982: So theme is not equal to "The early bird catches the worm".

engcitguy: exactly.  theme does tell us how human beings react

engcitguy: it is a general observation about life presented in this story

timallen8: maybe we could discuss theme in the context of the stories we have read

engcitguy: we will get there in a second

engcitguy: when you state a theme, it will be complete sentence

engcitguy: in MDG, what is the theme?

engcitguy: try to avoid a single word

timallen8: Guns don't hunt people; people do.

engcitguy: avoid cliches or old sayings

EricLBecker1982: That's a moral, isn't it?

engcitguy: or morals

engcitguy: avoid old sayings or morals

phildo6966 has entered the room.

engcitguy: what is the author pointing out about human behavior?

phildo6966: sorry im late, took the server 12 attempts

engcitguy: well

timallen8: People can be evil

engcitguy: yer here now phil

engcitguy: is that supported by the entire text, tim>?

EricLBecker1982: Sometimes people are not really the way that they present themselves to be.

timallen8: Not the entire text. I suppose if Rainsford were an awful person it would

girl5024: sorry, but i missed something, what's MDG?

engcitguy: remember that although themes are general, they must be supported directly by the 
story.

engcitguy: most dangerous game

FRECKLS4ME: Most Dangerous Game

engcitguy: thanks freckles

girl5024: that's what i thought at first:-P

girl5024: thanks

EricLBecker1982: Zaroff presents himself as a calm, sane individual at first glance, but it turns out 
that he's got an insane taste for hunting members of his own race.

engcitguy: a theme cannot be so general that it covers every story you've ever read

engcitguy: but it must be general enough to encompass all of the action in the story

FRECKLS4ME: is it the continual need for challenge

timallen8: Does every story have a theme?

engcitguy: yes in this class

engcitguy: what about the continual need  freckles

engcitguy: make it into a sentence

timallen8: The theme was Americans are the best and they prove it no matter where they go.

FRECKLS4ME: ARP says that not all stories have a theme pg. 102.  Does that mean in this class 
we will only be reading the ones that do.

engcitguy: freckles, that is why I said "in this class"

engcitguy: yes

phildo6966: fiction?

engcitguy: Allen, is the primary conflict between zaroff and Rainsford focused around who is 
American

timallen8: No. 

engcitguy: or  is the conflict deeper

engcitguy: phill, I'm not sure what your question refers to

timallen8: yes Zaroff is evil and Rainsford is not. There is something personal to this death match

engcitguy: then generalize the theme within that context Allen

timallen8: BOnnie - the theme is the triumph of good over evil

phildo6966: all fiction has a theme?

engcitguy: what about the triumph of good over evil

timallen8: BOnnie-that good always prevails

engcitguy: no phill, the fiction you read  in this class will have a theme 

timallen8: Bonnie-except for in interpretive literature. MAybe.

engcitguy: Bonnie, can you narrow the theme down to something a little more specific that would reflect the actual conflict that occurred in the story

engcitguy: the whole idea behind theme is that the author is using story to make an observation 
about the world.  In other words in thematic based stories, the purpose is in the theme... the method is the story

engcitguy: for example,

timallen8: The evil Mr. Zaroff will ultimately lose to the good Mr. Rainsford

timallen8: or Mr. Zaroffs of the world if you will

engcitguy: take out the names and you have a theme

timallen8: Evil will ultimately lose to good

engcitguy: theme is generalized enough that although it covers the story, it is not linked only to 
the story, but also to life itself

timallen8: Which brings us to Once Upon A time

engcitguy: actually, where I wanted to take this was fairy tales

engcitguy: Little Red riding hood

engcitguy: what is the author telling us about human nature in Little Red riding hood

timallen8: Trusting others is dangerous

engcitguy: yes

girl5024: don't trust grandma if she has great big eyes haha

engcitguy: what other aspect of the story is important to the story besides trusting others

phildo6966: evil dies

engcitguy: what did the girl not do that she was supposed to do

timallen8: Talk to the wolf

engcitguy: not do Allen

FRECKLS4ME: go directly to grandmas house

engcitguy:  yes freckles

EricLBecker1982: That many humans (represented by Red Riding Hood) are naive and 
susceptible to being deceived into breaking rules if someone who is ingenious enough (the wolf) 
can find a way to entice them.

timallen8: Why does grandma live in the woods alone?

engcitguy: yes Eric

engcitguy: this is very old Germany Allen

engcitguy: everyone lives in the woods

timallen8: Why does Little Red Riding hoods mom send her through the forest alone? When there 
are wolves and lumberjacks

EricLBecker1982: When was "Little Red Riding Hood" written?

engcitguy: and the Wood z are representational

engcitguy: in what way is little Red riding hood a universal idea

engcitguy: instead of looking at the particulars... Woods wolves

timallen8: Listen to your parents dumb littlekids

engcitguy: generalized with the authors talking about and then discuss whether or not it is 
relevant to us today

engcitguy: exactly

engcitguy: obey them

engcitguy: because what is out there?

girl5024: that children shouldn't go out by themselves

timallen8: BIG BAD WOLVES and insurance salesman

engcitguy: at some point, girl, kids have to go by themselves

engcitguy: what is a modern-day big bad wolf

girl5024: little kids

engcitguy: what is the modern-day woods

L8T Jayde: don't talk to strangers

timallen8: Bonnie - that is the way they learn

timallen8: The hood

FRECKLS4ME has left the room.

timallen8: OR the Burbs 

EricLBecker1982: Modern-day woods...going home to an empty house with nothing to do.

girl5024: drug dealers, rapists, murders

engcitguy:  girl, the girl is also symbolic

engcitguy: what does a little girl represent

timallen8: innocence

engcitguy: yes

engcitguy: the theme in this simple child's story is really about paying attention and being aware 
of the evils in the world

EricLBecker1982: Modern-day big-bad-wolf?  Drugs, sex, rock-n-roll and the whole shebang.  
Peers.  Television.  The media.  Brittney Spears.

engcitguy: especially spears

EricLBecker1982: Pardon me, only one "t" in Britney Spears.

engcitguy: (((((shuddering)))

timallen8: in stereo

engcitguy: that's okay, only my daughter would know the difference

engcitguy: and she's not here

engcitguy: because we can recognize the universality of the tale despite it being centered in 
1600's Germany, a story has meaning and purpose for us

engcitguy: likewise, when we read once upon a time, most of us can see there is a message for 
us, even if we do not live in South Africa

girl5024: so the littlie girl is symbolic of innocence and the hunter who saves her is the good in the 
world defeating evil?

engcitguy: that is because the authors theme is universal

engcitguy: yes girl

engcitguy: and wolf is bad influences

engcitguy: and the woods it is a scary environment that is also uncertain

engcitguy: that contains hidden dangers

engcitguy: and the flowers that she stopped to pick, which allows the wolf to beat her to 
Grandma's house, are the things that draws away from our tasks

timallen8: what about theme professor?

engcitguy: in other words, the moral to Little Red riding Hood's story is don't talk to wolves or 
don't talk to strangers

engcitguy: the theme is that we tend to disregard the council of our parents

timallen8: Kids that speak to wolves are dumb

engcitguy: and we tend to be easily distracted by things that on the surface seem pleasant

timallen8: like candy

engcitguy: notes that the theme is an observation about human behavior

girl5024: to think this was just a children's story and we've turned it into a made for tv movie

timallen8: ???????

engcitguy: and has nothing to do with wolves or little girls wearing red

phildo6966: hello?

timallen8: Hannibal?

engcitguy: yes phil?

phildo6966: ok sorry

engcitguy: theme is a message about us that the author presents in the story... in other words the 
story is an example of that idea

engcitguy: what is the main focus for Rainsford in most dangerous game

timallen8: To survive

engcitguy: what is the author telling us about survival

timallen8: Bonnie - he is the good guy

timallen8: It is important

engcitguy: try again

engcitguy: yes Bonnie but that is not Rainsford's goal

L8T Jayde: To outsmart evil

timallen8: he must survive to defeat the tyrannical Zaroff

timallen8: and his friend IVan too

engcitguy: yes J; yes Alan...according to the author, what does it take to defeat evil

EricLBecker1982: Good.

engcitguy: more than that

timallen8: Good Americans

engcitguy: more than that

timallen8: Rainsford

engcitguy: do we did the impression that Whitney would have survived the game

phildo6966: honesty

EricLBecker1982: It takes good and a situation where good and evil clash and sets up a situation 
where good has to defeat evil.

engcitguy: getting closer phil

timallen8: no he is too thoughtful. Only real men that do not hesitate to kill

timallen8: when it is good to kill

engcitguy: getting closer Allen

engcitguy: what does Rainsford do or have to do to survive

timallen8: Kill Zaroff

EricLBecker1982: Instinct.

phildo6966: gentlemanly duel

engcitguy: what resources must he rely on

EricLBecker1982: Logic.

engcitguy: good answers Eric

timallen8: Instinct. Malaysian traps

phildo6966: experience

engcitguy: generalize the second answer, allen

engcitguy: yes phil

timallen8: Good people often have to rely on their instincts to defeat evil

engcitguy: generalized the evil... make irrelevant to you.  For the modern-day reader, give 
analogy to zaroff

EricLBecker1982: Hrmmm...that means there's better answers...instinct...logic....good 
answers....hmmm.....he has to have the will to survive.

timallen8: irrelevant?

engcitguy: Allen, that is the best theme you've given all today 

engcitguy: yes Eric

timallen8: awe shucks

engcitguy: give me a modern-day Zaroff

engcitguy: it does not be a person

EricLBecker1982: Saddam Hussein.

timallen8: Analogy to Zaroff = Quadaffi

timallen8: Noriega. 

timallen8: Drug lords from hell.

engcitguy:  how likely are you to run into any of those people

girl5024: someone or something that likes to hunt people?

L8T Jayde: drugs

engcitguy: thinking day-to-day existence

timallen8: If you are Crocodile Dundee very likely

engcitguy: for some people, yes, J.

timallen8: Landlords

timallen8: Lawyers

L8T Jayde: poverty

engcitguy: remember that theme is relevant to most people, not the individuals who stand out in 
society

girl5024: likely just walking down the street

EricLBecker1982: My supervisor....appears nice, but deep down isn't.  ::Laughs::

timallen8: HMO

engcitguy: better answers Allen

engcitguy: good answer girl

engcitguy: good answer Eric

engcitguy: just like we saw a little Red riding hood, with the wolf, Zaroff represents what we face 
everyday

timallen8: Bonnie -challenges

engcitguy: and the theme is based around that survival of that bad thing... but thing that seeks to 
destroy us

engcitguy: exactly Bonnie

timallen8: Bonnie Problems

L8T Jayde: society

engcitguy: theme does not mention the specific characters or even specific plot of the work

engcitguy: yes Bonnie yes J.

timallen8: Always generalize to the point we do not know the specifics of a story

engcitguy: but at the same time is reflected directly in the story

engcitguy: for instance, if we were to over generalize the theme in most dangerous game, we 
could apply it to once upon a time

engcitguy: survival has its risks

L8T Jayde: Like, In a perfect world one is never really safe.  Once Upon A Time

engcitguy: or something like that

timallen8: No in a perfect world One would be safe. They certainly wouldn't have racial 
oppression 

timallen8: or needs for gates and barbed wire

engcitguy: but the theme for once upon a time will be quite different from most dangerous game 
because the plot line and characters are different and the authors are pointing to a specific theme

timallen8: Yup

engcitguy: try a theme for once upon a time

timallen8: security does not come from gadgets and doohickeys

engcitguy: okay

engcitguy: anyone else

EricLBecker1982: Someone's surface does not always indicate the way that they really are.

L8T Jayde: Obsession will only destroy that which we set out to protect.

engcitguy: remember that there may be several themes in a good story.  These themes may be 
related, and even very similar, but they will be reflected from different angles.  It is like looking at 
a multisided object from different angles

timallen8: As long as there is poverty and racial oppression there is no security

engcitguy: Eric, you would have to show me that the surface and under the service are different

engcitguy: good theme J.

engcitguy: good theme Allen

EricLBecker1982: Throughout the story, we focus on this need to NOT be racist and to protect 
ourselves in order to prove that we're not racist and to prove we're not racist, we need to not 
include the race we're not being racist against in our lives...that's something that reigns 
throughout "Once Upon A Time".

engcitguy: within that context Eric, your theme works.  And as long as you could apply that to 
most of the major characters, it would work

engcitguy: paper two will be based on theme

EricLBecker1982: All right.

engcitguy: we will use various devices, setting, point of view, and symbolism to illustrate how the 
author gets the theme across in the work

timallen8: Bonnie -when are we going to start the next paper

engcitguy: we will review theme and began discussing setting and point of view next week

engcitguy: as soon as you hand in paper one Bonnie

timallen8: Should we begin reading a new story

engcitguy: the two next stories should be together... LOVE IN LA  and the father

engcitguy: read them and tried to figure out what theme the author is showing us.  Both of them 
are incredibly short

girl5024: when is the second paper due?

engcitguy: I will announce a due date in a couple weeks.  Figure about four or five weeks from 
now

engcitguy: read both for next week

engcitguy: we will discuss answers to bride, and then start on those immediately

engcitguy: any questions

EricLBecker1982: None here.

engcitguy: finish your papers

L8T Jayde: here neither 

girl5024: just some clarifications about the paper

engcitguy:  take your test

engcitguy: go-ahead girl

girl5024: will we be marked down if we don't critique anyone else's paper on turnitin

engcitguy: your participation will be

girl5024: or get ours critiqued 

engcitguy: for the last paper, yes

timallen8: we have to go to turnitin for integrated

engcitguy: no Tim

engcitguy: whether you exchange papers by e-mail, at eternity and, or in class, or on campus, it 
makes no difference to me

girl5024: you're talking about integrated right?

engcitguy: any class

engcitguy: find another English student to help you discuss your paper.  Turn it in.com is just one 
way

engcitguy: anything else

phildo6966: nope

EricLBecker1982: Not here.

engcitguy:  then I will see you all next week

timallen8: No

girl5024: bye

timallen8: See ya

engcitguy: bye girl

phildo6966: adios

engcitguy: bye bonnie

timallen8: Bonnie - bye:-)

engcitguy: hasta luegos, sr phil

EricLBecker1982: All right, bye everyone!

engcitguy: bye tim

engcitguy: bye eric

engcitguy: poof

EricLBecker1982: POOF!

EricLBecker1982 has left the room.

phildo6966 has left the room.

timallen8 has left the room.

girl5024 has left the room.

L8T Jayde: bye

engcitguy: bye j

engcitguy: repoof